(no subject)

[cblj_backup]

I really need to come up with a better way to document my reading habits than the "book reviews" tag. Maybe I need to actually use my goodreads account or something. Because sometimes you just don't want to do a review!

But I will. The theme of this review: Lawrence Block's "Telling Lies For Fun And Profit" is a perfectly decent book except for two things.

a) This is stuff I learned when I was nineteen. This kind of book was once necessary, before the web, but now everyone and their brother blogs about the harrowing process of writing and publishing fiction. And the thing is, it's basically just a collection of well-arranged columns he wrote for a magazine, so it's not a lot of new ground even when it was first published.

b) He doesn't apparently know about fanfic, and he bases a lot of his teaching on the idea that writing isn't fun or something anyone would ever do for free. Which...bzuh?

In chapter eight or nine he said that it's a good idea to stop reading books that you don't enjoy or aren't getting anything from. So I stopped reading. And that sounds so catty, but I don't need to be told "read a lot" or "make other people read your work" or "don't get discouraged when someone criticises your work". I know these things.

Actually that bit did get me thinking. Are we all familiar with the Table Of Praise And Criticism?

When I was seven I had a teacher who had a really high opinion of the cognitive reasoning skills of seven year olds (to be fair I was pretty bright). He taught us about the Table Of Praise And Criticism, which I think is the bedrock upon which my ability to accept criticism is based:

I'm not sure if "unhelpful" was the term, but it's less stigmatised than "useless" which is what I suspect my teacher used.

There are four forms of feedback: Constructive Praise ("I liked the way you described the tree on page five"), Constructive Criticism ("I think your storyline gets lost in chapter four"), Unhelpful Praise ("This was great!"), and Unhelpful Criticism ("You suck"). This is nicely organised and appeals to me.

We spent a lot of time in class learning to identify and separate Constructive from Unhelpful, which gets more and more complicated the older you get. The nice thing about the table is that it minimizes the value judgment placed on the artist, because it's focused on evaluating the feedback and the person providing the feedback.

Unhelpful Praise is not necessarily a bad thing. Everyone likes to be told they're awesome. If it doesn't contribute to the development of the artist, it doesn't actively hurt them, either. On the other hand, there was no greater sin as a seven year old than committing Unhelpful Criticism. Because unhelpful criticism reflects badly on you as a person, that all you can think of to do is be mean.

The point is, really, that while you do put yourself into your work, criticism of the work is not criticism of the person, and the only valuable criticism is specific, direct, and aimed at improving the work rather than denigrating it (because that's Unhelpful Criticism).

Um, so it's easy to say "Don't listen to the haters", but it's much more helpful to give people a way to separate useful from hateful, and a framework within which to defend themselves.

Well, that came out not at all like a book review.

Comments

[ihlanya.livejournal.com]

This is actually a brilliant life skill to teach all of us!

[nutmeg3.livejournal.com]

Love your icon!

RFM

[kallaneboi.livejournal.com]

There were massive tornadoes throughout the Southeast on Wednesday. I was in Tuscaloosa during the storms, and the city is suffering badly. People are without homes or cars and businesses are destroyed. I am fine, my apartment is fine, although the surrounding neighborhoods in my area are unrecognizable. People in the library school have been compiling ways to help:

http://legislativebarbie.blogspot.com/2011/04/tuscaloosa-tornado-relief-efforts.html

http://bama-slis.libguides.com/helpBama

There are others around, including this one to help find people who are missing: http://www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20110428/MULTIMEDIA/110429675

A simple way to help is to text FOOD to 27722 to donate $10 to the West Alabama Foodbank, which is helping to feed people without food from the tornadoes.

I've also posted this at my LJ, so you could just link there.

Re: RFM

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

I can absolutely RFM! Thanks for the links, I was having trouble finding cohesive info on my own.

[jonaht.livejournal.com]

What a great blog!

[jonaht.livejournal.com]

ahem. The Table you used reminds me of the time I learned from a similar one except it related more towards poetry. It came in useful.

Also, thumbs up for goodreads.

Also,"In chapter eight or nine he said that it's a good idea to stop reading books that you don't enjoy or aren't getting anything from. So I stopped reading." LoLs. It is good advice though. I use that advice regularly when going through my reading pile. Life is too short to waste on bad books.

[derien.livejournal.com]

I love this! there was no greater sin as a seven year old than committing Unhelpful Criticism. Because unhelpful criticism reflects badly on you as a person, that all you can think of to do is be mean.

Oh, would that some teacher of EVERY child taught this table and instilled that value!

[nutmeg3.livejournal.com]

That's a wonderful chart and applicable to so much more than lit crit. Like politics.

[calliope-jones.livejournal.com]

In chapter eight or nine he said that it's a good idea to stop reading books that you don't enjoy or aren't getting anything from. So I stopped reading.

That. LOL.
I was just reading this truly awful romance novel. And all I wanted was for someone else to read it to commiserate about how awful it was. But about 100 pages in I had to put it down because it was just THAT BAD. It hurt to read.

[mistresscurvy.livejournal.com]

This was one of the first things we learned in an actors training program I did back in the day -- separating out value judgments ("that performance was good" or "that performance was bad") from critiques that forced both the observer and the performer to engage -- the observer/audience member/critic had to be able to identify what specifically worked about a performance or production, and what didn't, which the actor could then take and compare against what it was that he or she was attempting to provoke. That way, you can also see the difference between mere subjective preferences about style or whatever and fundamentals.

It's why I always try to really listen to constructive criticism and immediately mock or ignore unhelpful criticism, because one will benefit me and one won't. I can't control how people react to my work, but I can certainly control how much stock I put in their opinions about it.

[celtprincess13.livejournal.com]

I think one of the main reasons I don't necessarily comment on stories I like but don't adore is because I prefer to provide constructive praise whenever I can. So if I can't pinpoint something specific I liked about a story, I'm unlikely to comment at all, because "Great story!" just doesn't seem like enough. And if I don't like something, unless I can (again) pinpoint why, I'm not gonna comment then either.

Which is my long-assed way of saying I love the little chart and even though I didn't necessarily ever break it down into those terms or that format, I obviously absorbed it at some point. I wish more people had been exposed to it and used it on a regular basis.

[sabra-n.livejournal.com]

Me too. Except then some people get sad that their quantity of reviews isn't high enough and I'm like, "I'M SORRY I DON'T CHECK IN EVERY CHAPTER TO SAY 'YAY' OR SOMETHING." :(

[eccentrikita.livejournal.com]

This. "Haters to the left" only works if the haters are, uh, hating, rather than pointing out legitimate issues. And I'm in the middle of either an age group or a geographical group or a socioeconomic group that apparently cannot make that distinction. It's frustrating.

[ignescent.livejournal.com]

Can I quote this bit: there was no greater sin as a seven year old than committing Unhelpful Criticism. Because unhelpful criticism reflects badly on you as a person, that all you can think of to do is be mean.
I'll attribute it and everything...

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

Sure, if you like :) I don't mind.

[allmadhere.livejournal.com]

Man, I need to find me a young child to teach this whole Constructive Criticism thing to, because that lesson would have meant a lot to me as a kid.

Rock on, awesome teacher.

[florahart]

I also have a pretty high opinion of the cognitive reasoning skills of 7 year olds (of children in general), and don't understand why, instead of assuming kids can't understand things, folks don't just give it a whirl and see if they do. (hint: frequently, either they do, or they gain some other truth that proves to be of interest; unless you're hoping to teach cannibalism for fun and profit, or are unable to simply change topics if it becomes clear this one isn't working, there's not a ton of likelihood of harm)

Which is to say, I approve of this table and approve of the teacher for teaching it.

[ruisseau.livejournal.com]

"In chapter eight or nine he said that it's a good idea to stop reading books that you don't enjoy or aren't getting anything from. So I stopped reading."

So, I've decided that this is why I'm not finishing The Aeneid even though it's for school. The semester is OVER, I'm graduating in 8 days, and I'm not nearly as invested in Aeneas and his son and Rome as I was in Odysseus and Penelope and Ithaca.

Sorry for anyone who loved it. . .

[firynze.livejournal.com]

Ahhh, Odyssey fanfic. How I hate you.

(yeah, not a big fan of the Aeneid, can you tell?)

[daizy2k2.livejournal.com]

I like this chart! Although, I give a lot of unhelpful praise...

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

It's still good though -- it helps build confidence and it's just plain nice to hear :)

[firynze.livejournal.com]

I love my Goodreads account. Even when I don't want to write a review, I can mark off books I've read. And it's GREAT for organizing my to-read list. :-D

Also, that table rocks. I endeavour to give constructive feedback - both positive and negative - whenever I do book reviews or read manuscripts. I find people take their harsh mistress of an editrix better when the feedback is actually useful...

[thorinsmistress.livejournal.com]

My problem is when the line between constructive and unhelpful criticism blurs due to the reviewer being mean and/or having a 'tude. It is SO interesting that you posted this when I have been dealing with it at work for the past two weeks. Yes, it is a very good thing that the final reviewer for our project found some errors; however, she doesn't have to be a complete and utter bitch about it. :(

And it doesn't count that all my superiors seem to hate the semi-colon with a vengeance.

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

Well, I think that was why we worked so hard to learn how to separate out the wheat from the chaff. It's totally possible to give two or three kinds of feedback in a single comment, and it's difficult to untangle content from tone if you're not used to it. But it really does help to remember that when someone is giving you helpful feedback but being an asshole about it, they generally aren't intending to be an asshole to you -- they're just an angry person, or they're frustrated with something else, and they're not trying to insult you personally.

Well, most of the time anyway :D

[bare-bear.livejournal.com]

I've always felt sort of useless as a reader of books/fanfic/anything written, because I'm not a writer nor a particularly observant reader, and I'm overly pleased with pretty much anything I read (and when I'm not, I channel Thumper: "if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all"). I nearly always fall in the 'unhelpful praise' category. I guess I'm a good cheerleader! :D

But since getting into sewing and the sewing community, and particularly since starting up my own sewing blog, I'm now understand the differences in the quality of comments. While I'm pleased when anyone comments, even with "that dress turned out great!" type praise (yay! \o/), nothing makes me happier than when I get constructive feedback on my projects, especially when I've asked for help or suggestions on how to fix a screw-up. This has, in turn, caused me to try to up the quality of the comments I leave on other sewing blogs beyond "ooo pretty".

I just wish I could apply this more to feedback on stories! I may be doomed to always been the cheerleader. And I'm pretty much fine with that! HURRAH!

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

Yeah, general praise is certainly still nice! But it's satisfying to have someone catch something and help you fix it, too :)

[sumofparts.livejournal.com]

Because sometimes you just don't want to do a review!

Totally agree. I just keep my list of books read in a spreadsheet but maybe I'll check out goodreads.

[adina-atl.livejournal.com]

Sam, may I please borrow this (with attribution if you wish) if a discussion on my church mailing list escalates?

We have a case of "Person A requested feedback, Persons B & C provides Constructive (IMHO) Criticism, Persons D, E, F, G, and H yelled at B & C for 'being negative.'" Person I (as in Me) has reminded people that chastising others for expressing an honest and polite opinion is Not Helpful, but we'll see how that goes.

[copperbadge.livejournal.com]

Of course! I saw your post, it sounds like a bit of an ugly scene. Sometimes a gentle reminder about what "constructive" means is in order :)

[justice-turtle.livejournal.com]

'I really need to come up with a better way to document my reading habits than the "book reviews" tag. Maybe I need to actually use my goodreads account or something. Because sometimes you just don't want to do a review!'

Me, I've started using my (brand new) Twitter with the #amreading hashtag. Because I don't have to have a notebook or computer handy, or remember after a long day "oh right, and I read Oedipus Rex on the bus for school", and the character limit means I CAN'T really do a "full review". It's a bit more like Sam's Three Things, only there's not even room for three. ;-) Maybe just 3a.